2014's are out
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dolt
Well-Known Member
I am cool; no worries here as I don't need or want what the new models have to offer and am quite content with my "old" models and there is an endless list of performance and cosmetic modification options available in the aftermarket.
"Perceived reliability"?? Interesting choice of words.
JDPEagle
Active Member
I guess I will continue to be in the minority here, but please don't call this a "water cooled" engine. It is NOT. Even the MoCo is marketing this as "Twin-Cooled" in order to avoid the false-advertising stigma. This is little more than a band-aid fix to the ever increasing restrictions by the EPA.
This merely cools the heads and the exhaust ports. Draw your own conclusions, but this partial cooling system caused disproportionate cooling down the cylinder walls, and thus contributed to seal and gasket issues in late 1970's Cessna aircraft engines. The design was later scraped. They filed patents for this design only 3 years ago (that couldn't have allowed for a lot of longevity R&D).
Don't get me wrong, Harley needed to do something. I would have respected an FLHTK with the V-Rod engine (a TRUE water cooled engine). We have all been saying that the days of the air cooled engines were numbered due to the ridiculous EPA requirements and phony gas (with ethanol + water). I just would have expected more than a half-hearted band-aid from H-D with a shiny bow (ie. LCD displays).
This merely cools the heads and the exhaust ports. Draw your own conclusions, but this partial cooling system caused disproportionate cooling down the cylinder walls, and thus contributed to seal and gasket issues in late 1970's Cessna aircraft engines. The design was later scraped. They filed patents for this design only 3 years ago (that couldn't have allowed for a lot of longevity R&D).
Don't get me wrong, Harley needed to do something. I would have respected an FLHTK with the V-Rod engine (a TRUE water cooled engine). We have all been saying that the days of the air cooled engines were numbered due to the ridiculous EPA requirements and phony gas (with ethanol + water). I just would have expected more than a half-hearted band-aid from H-D with a shiny bow (ie. LCD displays).
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J
Jack Klarich
Guest
:s I hope you are right Don, We will need Hoople to be on his toes with the electrical end, The mechanical end will take of it self IMO
dolt
Well-Known Member
Learning to work on one is not the issue and less of an issue for the DIY guys; they will figure it out, get whatever additional tools that may be required, roll up their sleeves and deal with the fact that what used to be a four hour job may now be an 8 hour job. However, the guys that have to pay the dealer to work on their bikes may not be happy that a cam upgrade might now cost twice as much in labor. Heck, there are techs that service bikes and forget to fill the crankcase with oil. What now with all the extra hardware to deal with??:unsure
Mavagrand
Senior Member
"Perceived reliability" was my attempt at avoiding a debate concerning "air cooled" vs. "water cooled" engines. I've been there, done that.
Eagle, I realize this engine is not a pure water cooled engine but, I believe, it is a step toward that eventuality.
Going to be interesting to see how these new engines hold up, if harley has addressed this disproportionate cooling issue.
Eagle, I realize this engine is not a pure water cooled engine but, I believe, it is a step toward that eventuality.
Going to be interesting to see how these new engines hold up, if harley has addressed this disproportionate cooling issue.
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glimmerman
Active Member
glad to hear/see so many unimpressed riders. after seeing the hype from harley i think i'm getting some new sneakers for the rk. just bought a new seat for the cash cow after 18 days and 6655 miles in june/july. don't think i'll ever get a new bike by the look of these. if i wanted a georgie jetson, i'd get a victory. put on an a/c, new pipes, sert, and dyno for the cow. got 87 ft/lbs and 71 hp at 13:1 a/f ratio on the 96 w/o cat. still respectable 44 mpg, 2 up. no need to get fancy.
screwylouie
Active Member
Obviously, the whole purpose here is to cool that part of the engine that is most likely to be damaged by a lean mixture, and therefore high heat, the area around the exhaust valve.
I think the factory has done a fantastic job! Can't blame Harley for catalytic converters(read; extremely hot to operate properly), quiet mufflers, 2 cams, belt drive, EPA MANDATED 14.7 : 1 air to fuel ratio(read; even hotter yet) and probably a few things I can't remember.
It's all because of EPA MANDATED noise and exhaust emissions requirements.
Where is there a 45degree V twin, big displacement, pushrod operated, air cooled(mostly), EPA LEGAL engine that is doing any better?
Get 'em while they're hot !:newsmile03:
I think the factory has done a fantastic job! Can't blame Harley for catalytic converters(read; extremely hot to operate properly), quiet mufflers, 2 cams, belt drive, EPA MANDATED 14.7 : 1 air to fuel ratio(read; even hotter yet) and probably a few things I can't remember.
It's all because of EPA MANDATED noise and exhaust emissions requirements.
Where is there a 45degree V twin, big displacement, pushrod operated, air cooled(mostly), EPA LEGAL engine that is doing any better?
Get 'em while they're hot !:newsmile03:
dolt
Well-Known Member
There ya go. Had the MoCo built a water cooled configuration around the 60* VRod motor; they might have impressed me. This is putting lipstick on a pig and a poor attempt at that. Be the first one on your block to get one.:s
D
dbmg
Guest
This water cooling though it is coming to market is just the 1st step. They now have to figure out how the unfaired bikes are going to get it. Maybe as Bubbie stated earlier only one hole for oil. No more engine and transmission but a engine trans combo like the imports. Maybe the V-Rod engine will be the transplant to all bikes....... I can only imagine where Harley is heading with all of this.