SE Pro Super Tuner + Smart Tune Software

[flh canuck]

Stage 2 103" (the final chapter):

Well, after playing with Smart Tune software a number of times, my motorcycle engine was pulling hard and I was pretty happy with the seat-of-the pants power but wanted to make sure my air/fuel was within safe limits across the board.

I like to put miles on and didn't want any doubt about my engine calibration while ripping across Nevada or Arizona this summer in the heat.

Engine was still running on the warm side and still had some decel popping so decided to bite the bullet and get my engine dyno tuned by Jarz Performance in Abbotsford.

Picked it up this afternoon and wow.... Runs absolutely perfectly, no more decel popping and also running cooler over all.

They did a before and after run so I could see the difference in the numbers between my smart tune and their dyno tune.

Before dyno tune: Max power 83.55 hp / 93.53 ft lbs torque

After dyno tune: Max power 91 hp / 108.1 ft lbs torque

Roads were a bit slick with rain on the way home so couldn't really get on it at lower speeds without breaking the back end loose but at higher speeds on the highway, she pulled real nice when getting on the throttle.

Not a neck snapping kinda power but just a strong steady rush up to 5000 rpm and then its time to shift and do it all over again.

When I took it in for dyno tuning, my main concern was ensuring that the air/fuel was within safe limits across the board. Jarz drills holes in the exhaust front and rear so they can tune each cylinder individually and what a difference. I was expecting to pick up a few more ponies but almost 8 more horsepower and 15 ft lbs was far better than expected.

I think the smart tune feature works well enough and perhaps I could have done better if I had done more runs and spent more time on it but based on my results, there is no replacement for a dyno run by a qualified tuner.

I can finally say the engine mods are done. Nothing left to do now except get out on the road and enjoy the ride...

 

[Hoople]

Nothing left to do now except get out on the road and enjoy the ride...

If you happen to have printed your before VE tables & A/F ratio map table, you now could view all the changes that were actually needed over and above Smart Tune to make it run right. I wouldn't expect smart to be of value during open loop mode, but it would be interesting to know and learn it's limits. This is where you would learn exactly what it takes to do it correctly. Your Dyno sheets should have an A/F line (front & rear) to use as a reference. The percent of uplift required in the 90-100 kPa region for power, the reduction in the 20 kPa region for decel popping and the increase needed in the 30 kPa for idle heat would be great things to know & share right now.

 

[Ripp]

Hoople

I have been following this Post and been applying what I have learned too my 2011 flhtk. Because I want to keep the bike quiet for the long trips the only thing I have changed is the air filter. I have found a map for a 103 with air filter and race exhaust, which I assume will make it run lean which so far my spark plugs agree.

Question if I increase the VE will that lower the AF ?

Thanks for this post
Ripp

 

[Grillfish]

Hoople

I have been following this Post and been applying what I have learned too my 2011 flhtk. Because I want to keep the bike quiet for the long trips the only thing I have changed is the air filter. I have found a map for a 103 with air filter and race exhaust, which I assume will make it run lean which so far my spark plugs agree.

Question if I increase the VE will that lower the AF ?

Thanks for this post
Ripp

Hoople can respond as well, but I would just use the closest map and then SmartTune it. Do 5-10 recorded runs smart tune each time, printing out your VE tables before and after and eventually you will see little changes to the VE values. You can also see where your changes are to ensure you are getting good coverage. Let the VE values be adjusted by the programing.

Good luck. Post your results or findings back here.

If you happen to have printed your before VE tables & A/F ratio map table, you now could view all the changes that were actually needed over and above Smart Tune to make it run right. I wouldn't expect smart to be of value during open loop mode, but it would be interesting to know and learn it's limits. This is where you would learn exactly what it takes to do it correctly. Your Dyno sheets should have an A/F line (front & rear) to use as a reference. The percent of uplift required in the 90-100 kPa region for power, the reduction in the 20 kPa region for decel popping and the increase needed in the 30 kPa for idle heat would be great things to know & share right now.

Agree with Hoople. I'd love to see the difference in what they changed to your ST map. Was it in VE tables, did they change the target AFR, maybe timing, etc...

 

[Hoople]

Hoople
Question if I increase the VE will that lower the AF ?

Yes. As you increase the VE numbers upward, the A/F ratio gets lower or Richer.

Your actually telling (or lying) to the software that more air is being pumped through the engine when it really isn't. Therefore to maintain the same A/F ratio, the ECM will extend the pulse width on the injector. But because you are lying, the air flow in reality is the same. So adding just more fuel without air will make the mixture more rich during open loop conditions.
This is the true meaning of "white lie"

 

[Ripp]

Thanks for the quick responses. I am waiting for warmer temps so I can better tune it. Right now in Michigan it is still in the 40 to 60 range.

Ripp

 

[Webbtron]

I too have been reading this thread since last weekend a friend ask for help in learning how to program his SEPST. What are the VE Tables?

 

[Hoople]

What are the VE Tables?

SERT Manual.pdf - File Shared from Box.net - Free Online File Storage

Page 126

 

[Webbtron]

Thanks Hopple This will be helpful and only a 100 pages no wonder my friend is treading water. What is the quick reference guide? 10 pages?

 

[flh canuck]

If you happen to have printed your before VE tables & A/F ratio map table, you now could view all the changes that were actually needed over and above Smart Tune to make it run right. I wouldn't expect smart to be of value during open loop mode, but it would be interesting to know and learn it's limits. This is where you would learn exactly what it takes to do it correctly. Your Dyno sheets should have an A/F line (front & rear) to use as a reference. The percent of uplift required in the 90-100 kPa region for power, the reduction in the 20 kPa region for decel popping and the increase needed in the 30 kPa for idle heat would be great things to know & share right now.

Sorry for not responding sooner but have been outta town. Unfortunately I never got an electronic copy of the dyno tuned file so I can't see exactly what was changed.

According to the dyno printout, my smart tune map a/f was pretty close to desired (13.4-1) during the initial 5th gear pull up to about 3700 rpm. From there it leaned out to 14-1 until abut 4700 rpm where it started dropping down to 12.5-1.

I suspect most of the increases in power were due to timing changes and of course getting the air/fuel spot on. According to the dyno graph, the increase in hp and torque was pretty consistent right across the rpm range which tells me timing was the biggest factor as even where my smart tune had the fuel right, the new tune showed a sizeable increase in hp and torque.

I have no plans to adjust anything further as the guys at Jarz know more about tuning Harleys than I ever will but I am surprised that the Harley SEPST canned map for the 103" was still lean even after making fairly siginificant increases in the ve tables.

The original canned map for the 96" was spot on and ran great with my original engine but the canned map for the 103" Screamin Eagle kit was way lean from the get go.

If I was do do it again, I would probably start off with a canned map for the 110" 255 equipped engine and see how that worked. I suspect the ve tables for that engine would be much closer to correct for my build vs the very lean 103" map.

That being said, I am now a firm believer in getting a proper dyno tune. A dyno tune eliminates all the guess work as far as air/fuel ratio and all settings can be adjusted for optimal performance in a controlled environment.